Itâs the final week before a new House GOP majority disbands the Jan. 6 select committee, and its members are using it to dump their thousands of pages of raw evidence into the public domain.
The panel has released transcripts of more than 100 witness interviews â still just a tenth of its total collection â with more dropping daily and shedding new light on the extraordinary effort by former President Donald Trump and his enablers to subvert the 2020 election.
Weâve been combing through the transcripts for new details that werenât previously aired during the committeeâs widely watched public hearings or in its voluminous final report released last week. Here are some of the highlights:
New details on Meadowsâ handling of documents
POLITICO first broke the news that Cassidy Hutchinson, an aide to former White House chief of staff Mark Meadows, told the select committee her then-boss sometimes burned documents in his office fireplace during the weeks leading up to Jan. 6 â including at times after meeting with Rep. Scott Perry (R-Pa.). Hutchinsonâs transcripts offer new details about what she says she witnessed.
It wasnât just once, Hutchinson recalled. She saw Meadows burn papers after Perryâs visits âbetween two and four times.â Those meetings, she said, were about âelection issues.â
Hutchinson also provided a lengthy description of a bizarre episode in which House Intelligence Committee Republican staffers trucked cartloads of documents to the White House and reviewed them in Meadowsâ office for potential release. The timing and description of the episode tracks closely with Trumpâs effort to declassify and expose records related to the FBIâs investigation of his campaignâs contacts with Russia, which Trump has long derided as a âwitch hunt.â
The former Meadows aide described the unusual way the document review proceeded, noting that the files were brought to the White House from the Capitol and that Meadows kept the original documents in an office safe, closely guarding them and keeping their origins secret. Eventually, he would produce at least eight copies of the documents, with varying degrees of redaction, intending to supply at least two of them to conservative media allies.
Hutchinson noted that one set of documents was meant for House GOP Leader Kevin McCarthy â but that the California Republican told her he wanted nothing to do with them. She said based on that conversation, she opted not to offer a set to Senate GOP Leader Mitch McConnell.
Transcripts also revealed Meadowsâ Secret Service code name: âLeverage.â
25th Amendment talk
The select committee has released transcripts from several members of Trumpâs Cabinet, mostly detailing the days immediately following the attack on Jan. 6, 2021. Most notable was the interview with former Labor Secretary Eugene Scalia, who discussed efforts to persuade Trump or his allies to convene a Cabinet meeting in order to take potential steps to limit Trumpâs actions in the final days of his administration. Scalia said he had spoken to other Cabinet members about what to do in the aftermath of the attack.
The panel spoke with Elaine Chao, Trumpâs Transportation secretary and wife to McConnell, who resigned immediately after Jan. 6 and took a more muted view of the post-attack discussions. She said she didnât recall her conversation with Scalia, but she agreed that Trumpâs actions on Jan. 6 contributed to her decision to resign.
âI wish that he had acted differently,â Chao said of Trump.
There was little serious consideration of the 25th Amendment, according to the transcripts. Marc Short, former Vice President Mike Penceâs chief of staff, told the panel why: Any genuine effort would take weeks, well beyond the end of Trumpâs term, given that the procedure gives the president a chance to appeal.
Short said he received a call from Speaker Nancy Pelosi and Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer to discuss the potential invocation of the 25th Amendment, but he said he refused to connect the call to Pence because Short viewed it as a purely political move.
Hutchinson also said she received calls from members of Congress for status updates on discussions on invoking the 25th Amendment. Among those who reached out, she said, were Sen. Roy Blunt (R-Mo.), McCarthy and Reps. Markwayne Mullin (R-Okla.) and Mike Johnson (R-La.).
Attorney-client relationships
Trump attorney Sidney Powell, who was a link between the president and some of his fringiest outside advisers, told the select committee that she had attorney-client relationships with four members of Congress over election-related matters. The four: Reps. Andy Biggs (R-Ariz.), Marjorie Taylor Greene (R-Ga.), Matt Gaetz (R-Fla.) and Louie Gohmert (R-Texas).
Trump allies feared legal repercussions for declaring themselves true electors
Federal prosecutors are eyeing the decisions of pro-Trump Republican activists in seven Biden-won states to design certificates that claimed they were the stateâs duly qualified presidential electors. That false electors scheme was a central element of Trumpâs bid to remain in power. But in two states â Pennsylvania and New Mexico â the electors insisted that the documents they signed included a caveat: Their status as true electors hinged on whether court rulings affected the outcome of the election.
That caveat may have saved them the legal scrutiny thatâs been applied in other states. And now, thanks to the interview of former Trump campaign official Mike Roman, itâs clear why it happened.
Committee staffers read an email from Trump campaign attorney Kenneth Chesebro noting that in a conference call with Pennsylvaniaâs pro-Trump elector nominees, a concern was raised about the potential for legal exposure if they signed documents without any qualifiers. Chesebro apparently suggested using the caveat in other states as well, but only New Mexico followed suit.
Mundane moments as the Capitol assault began
The select committee transcripts are littered with personal stories about where witnesses were the moment rioters bashed their way into the Capitol. Two from Penceâs top aides stand out. His chief counsel, Greg Jacob, described being at the Capitol refectory on the first floor of the Senate, grabbing a coffee, when a nearby window was smashed in by a rioter with a police shield. That turned out to be Dominic Pezzola, a Proud Boy and the very first rioter to breach the building.
âThere was no security that I could see down there, and the glass had shattered just down the hall from where we are, probably 60 feet away,â Jacob recalled.
Jacob said he quickly tapped out an email to attorney John Eastman â an architect of Trumpâs last-ditch bid to stay in power â with whom heâd been feuding throughout the day. Jacob told the committee that to get back to Pence, who by then had left the Senate floor, he followed the military aide with the so-called nuclear football, a briefcase with the nuclear codes, convinced that she would be permitted to get close to the vice president.
Short recalled a similar experience, except he was one floor lower than Jacob, getting lunch from the Senate carryout.
âYouâre in line waiting for a cheeseburger when all hell breaks loose,â a committee staffer noted during Shortâs interview.
Short said he sprinted back to Penceâs location as rioters began to enter the building. âI never got my cheeseburger,â he noted.
The most hostile Jan. 6 interview
Rep.-elect Max Millerâs (R-Ohio) interview with the Jan. 6 select committee was notable if only for the outright hostility he and his lawyer displayed for the panel.
Even other witnesses who had little regard for the committee largely played nice in their interviews. But Miller and his attorney repeatedly derided the panelâs investigators, objected to even basic, foundational questions and openly attacked the committee as an illegitimate âshowâ rather than a serious probe.
âItâs a simple question,â an unidentified committee interviewer said, at one point, after Millerâs attorney objected to a question about how often Miller interacted with Trump during the months before Jan. 6. âNo one is trying to do a perjury trap.â
Later, Millerâs attorney Larry Zukerman attacked the committee investigator for âputting on a show for the congresswoman and the congressmanâ â a reference to Reps. Liz Cheney (R-Wyo.) and Adam Kinzinger (R-Ill.), who had dialed into the call.
âYou know, this is all pomp and circumstance here that will eventually lead to nothing,â Zukerman said.
Eventually, the repeated insults provoke Kinzinger to chime in, accusing Millerâs attorney of being the one trying to âput on a show.â He then inadvertently referred to the committee as âthe prosecution,â prompting a sharp response from Miller, who said he viewed Cheneyâs presence in the interview as âtrying to intimidate me because I knocked your buddy off the blockâ â a reference to his primary victory over Cheney ally Anthony Gonzalez earlier this year.
Fuentes was eyed by criminal investigators
Nick Fuentes made headlines when Trump hosted him as a dinner guest in November, but the select committee had long eyed him as figure of interest for the role his âGroyperâ movement played in the attack on the Capitol. Groypers are the followers of the white nationalist Fuentes, and several of them have been charged for playing leading roles on Jan. 6.Fuentes didnât go into the Capitol but was outside as rioters clashed with police, and he later described the scene as âawesome.â
In his February deposition, Fuentes pleaded the Fifth, and his attorney informed the select committee that the U.S. attorneyâs office in D.C. had labeled him a âsubject and possibly a targetâ of an ongoing criminal probe.
Dan Quayle, the conscience
The former vice president was more ubiquitous than previously known in his effort to advise figures around Trump about how to handle his efforts to subvert the election.
Quayle, notably, advised Pence not to attempt to overturn the election results on Jan. 6 and rather to perform the traditional, constitutionally required task of counting electoral votes certified by the states. But in a transcript of Trump national security adviser Robert OâBrienâs interview, Quayle emerged yet again. He was among the voices, OâBrien noted, telling him not to resign, as Republican mainstays fretted about potential chaos in the closing days of Trumpâs administration.
Drama among the organizers of the Jan. 6 rally
The select committee transcripts lay bare the open hostility between different factions of Trumpâs âStop the Stealâ allies.
Kimberly Guilfoyle was feuding with GOP fundraiser Caroline Wren. White House adviser Max Miller said Katrina Pierson exaggerated her influence. Pierson advised Trump to keep âpsychosâ off the rally stage, saying he shouldnât give speaking slots to Roger Stone, Alex Jones and Michael Flynn.
âYouâre done for life with me because I wonât pay you a $60,000 speaking fee for an event you arenât speaking at?â Wren said to Guilfoyle, per select committee records. âThatâs fucking insane.â
Deals to shield evidence from DOJ
The Jan. 6 select committee indicated in numerous interviews with defendants â some awaiting sentencing for storming the Capitol â that it had agreed not to share any evidence it obtained during its interview with the Justice Department, unless that evidence described additional crimes or the committee suspected perjury.
Those promises at least partially explain the panelâs fraught relationship with the Justice Department that became a theme throughout the latter half of its investigation, with the department repeatedly trying to obtain witness transcripts, only to be rebuffed by the panel until mid-December.
Lofgren beefs with Tarrio
When Proud Boys leader Enrique Tarrio submitted to a deposition â just weeks before he was charged for his role in the events of Jan. 6 â Rep. Zoe Lofgren (D-Calif.) used the moment to pop in for a quick confrontation.
She pointed to something called âTarrioâs Telegram,â in which Tarrio printed a picture of Lofgren with a caption that apparently called her the c-word, saying she was âblind in one eye.â
âIâm wondering what you meant by that,â she asked Tarrio.
Tarrio said he didnât recall posting the item. Lofgren then left the deposition as quickly as she arrived.
The issue popped up again, when a committee staffer squarely asked Tarrio whether he called Lofgren the c-word, prompting his lawyer, Dan Hull, to pop in and question the relevance of the questioning.
âThatâs a word thatâs been around since the 1300s in London. Itâs not a particularly nice word for a lot of people, but ââ
âYou know the history of that word?â a committee staffer replied.
âUnfortunately, I do,â Hull said.
0 commentaires